Episode 442: Stop Selling, Start Connecting: Andrew Jenkins on Smarter Social Selling
In this episode of Making Sales Social, Brynne Tillman sits down with Andrew Jenkins, entrepreneur, speaker, and author of Social Media Marketing for Business to explore what it truly means to make sales social. Andrew shares how today’s best social sellers focus less on the pitch and more on building genuine, valuable connections. He dives into the dangers of automation overload, the importance of human engagement in a digital-first world, and his “3 Cs of Social ROI” Community, Content, and Conversion for measuring real success. From his first tweet with a typo to discovering insights on TikTok, Andrew’s journey highlights the balance between data, authenticity, and social intelligence. Whether you’re refining your LinkedIn strategy or rethinking your digital approach, this conversation will help you strengthen your brand, deepen relationships, and make every connection count.
View Transcript
Andrew Jenkins (00:00)
It’s less about selling and more about making valuable connections — not focusing on the pitch. If you pay it forward and focus on helping others get what they need, it’s the cliché: if you help someone get what they need, it will help you get what you need.
Intro (00:17)
Welcome to the Making Sales Social podcast, featuring the top voices in sales, marketing, and business. Join Brynne Tillman and me, Bob Woods, as we each bring you the best tips and strategies our guests are teaching their clients so you can leverage them for your own virtual and social selling. Enjoy the show!
Brynne Tillman (00:42)
Welcome back to Making Sales Social! I’m Brynne Tillman, and I’m so excited to introduce today’s guest, Andrew Jenkins. Andrew is a highly regarded entrepreneur, international speaker, university instructor, podcast host, and author of Social Media Marketing for Business.
Having led his agency, Volterra, for over 18 years, he specializes in outsourced social media management and social selling training, working with both B2B and B2C clients across various industries. With deep expertise in social media strategies, Andrew has successfully conducted workshops and programs for sales teams at prominent firms, shaping how organizations navigate the digital landscape.
His keen insights into social selling and digital strategy will provide our listeners with valuable takeaways to enhance their sales techniques. Andrew, welcome to Making Sales Social!
Andrew Jenkins (01:44)
Wow, I hope I live up to that. Thanks for having me.
Brynne Tillman (01:52)
You’re amazing! We’ve spent quite a bit of time together lately, and I’m really excited to have you on as my guest because fabulous things come out of your mouth in the social selling world. But before we jump into your genius, we ask all our guests the same first question: what does making sales social mean to you?
Andrew Jenkins (02:17)
Well, it’s a timely question because it’s something I was just talking about earlier today. It might seem counterintuitive, but it’s less about selling and more about making valuable connections — not focusing on the pitch.
If you pay it forward, focus on helping others, and support them in getting what they need, it helps you in the long run. Taking that “pay it forward” mindset leads to better things for your business, as opposed to what we’re seeing too often — spray-and-pray, poorly targeted messages clogging up inboxes. The focus should be on the social, not the selling.
Brynne Tillman (03:08)
I love that. Your journey into social media began with a memorable first tweet. How did that early experience shape your approach to social media marketing?
Andrew Jenkins (03:26)
As I mention on my LinkedIn profile, my first tweet had a typo, so my second tweet was an apology for the typo in the first one. A friend replied and said, “Just relax.” That’s been my mantra ever since.
We still advise clients not to say or do anything on social that they wouldn’t want discussed in court — or explained to their grandmother in front of a crowd.
Brynne Tillman (04:00)
Or printed and put on your competitor’s desk!
Andrew Jenkins (04:03)
Exactly! Those are great ways to govern yourself. Over the years, through Twitter, LinkedIn, and other platforms, I’ve focused on being social and helpful — paying it forward, sharing valuable content, and yes, the occasional humble brag.
I was among the first 200,000 users on LinkedIn and have watched it evolve over 20-plus years. Social media has been instrumental — not just because I run a social agency, but because it’s shaped my entire career.
Brynne Tillman (04:55)
I love the “just relax” mindset — it’s not surgery!
Andrew Jenkins (05:03)
Exactly! So often we overthink it. Some clients have ten people involved in approving one social post — it’s not the best use of time. By the time a trending meme gets approval, it’s old news. Sometimes, you just have to ship it while ensuring it still represents your brand.
Brynne Tillman (05:53)
So what other mistakes are you seeing?
Andrew Jenkins (06:09)
Too many people involved in the process is a big one. Another major issue is overreliance on AI. While there’s value in AI for automation and efficiency, too many are switching to autopilot. Feeds are filling up with AI-generated fluff and fake profile views, along with disingenuous, poorly targeted messages.
You wouldn’t send an AI bot to a networking event on your behalf, so why do it on LinkedIn?
Brynne Tillman (06:56)
Yes, I’ve said that too! We often remind people — treat the person on the other side of the message the same way you would across the table. They’re human beings, not leads.
Andrew Jenkins (07:18)
Exactly. If I’m signing up for a $9.95 SaaS product, fine — I don’t need much trust or rapport. But if I’m committing $1,000 a month, I want to talk to a person. We buy from people we like and trust — and I can only like an AI bot so much.
Brynne Tillman (08:00)
I agree completely. On social, though, to get to “know, like, and trust,” I think we first need to attract, teach, and engage.
Andrew Jenkins (08:22)
Absolutely — we’re aligned on that.
Brynne Tillman (08:25)
Any other major mistakes you’re seeing out there?
Andrew Jenkins (08:37)
Yes — one I call “using your own lens.” People often view social media only through how they use it. But your audience may use it differently. Just because you prefer one platform doesn’t mean your audience does.
Brynne Tillman (09:17)
Exactly. Treat them the way they want to be treated, not the way you want to.
Andrew Jenkins (09:22)
Right. We had a menswear retail client once who got a customer inquiry via Facebook. When we told them, they said, “Couldn’t they have just called us?”
We had to explain: the consumer chose their preferred channel — Facebook Messenger. If you open a social channel, you must be ready to engage there. Every channel you open has to be resourced properly with content and support.
Brynne Tillman (10:19)
That makes so much sense. So, what’s your actual definition of social selling?
Andrew Jenkins (10:27)
To me, social selling is using social media to identify and engage with people — not necessarily to make a sale, but to build relationships. It’s about engaging, listening, and gathering social intelligence. You learn from digital breadcrumbs — who they engage with, what content they share, and what matters to them.
Brynne Tillman (11:06)
I love that social listening piece. In my definition — building rapport, developing trust and credibility, being a resource — I realize I’ve missed that listening element.
Andrew Jenkins (11:26)
Social is data-rich. We can learn so much before we even message someone. Even inactivity tells you something. I once met with executives at a media company and, using only their public posts, guessed things about them — like who had a PhD or who loved their dog. They were shocked! It’s amazing what people reveal online without realizing it.
Brynne Tillman (12:24)
I love that. I recently congratulated someone on LinkedIn for knowing the Pope — just because we both went to Villanova! It sparked a great connection. Small insights can build big rapport.
Andrew Jenkins (13:18)
Exactly. Even on LinkedIn, mutual connections can validate someone. When I get invitations, I check who we have in common. It’s a small but powerful form of trust.
Brynne Tillman (14:14)
Right. It’s a mistake to connect with everyone — but also to connect with only people you know. I usually connect with people I’d want to chat with at a networking event.
Andrew Jenkins (14:38)
Same here. I look at their title, company, and intent. If it’s obvious they’re just looking to pitch, that’s a red flag.
Brynne Tillman (14:52)
I reply to those folks and ask how they found me.
Andrew Jenkins (14:56)
Exactly — that’s their hurdle. If they can’t answer meaningfully, that tells you something.
Brynne Tillman (15:02)
Right. But when I get automated messages like, “I looked at your profile and was impressed,” and it includes emojis copied from my name — I know it’s fake. Occasionally, I’ll even report those now!
Andrew Jenkins (15:37)
I’m the same — I have an emoji in front of my name to trip up autoresponders or automated messaging. I once got two different messages from two different people from the same company. One of them was the CEO, and it came at two in the morning on a Saturday night.
I took screenshots of both messages — they were 99% identical — and sent them back to the CEO. I said, “Whatever automated service provider you’re using, stop, because this is what’s happening.” He panicked and replied, “Someone from the team thought it was a good idea. We’ve turned it off.”
Brynne Tillman (16:16)
Yeah, and that’s a good prospect for you too.
Andrew Jenkins (16:19)
Exactly. But I said, “How many hundreds of people did you send this to before realizing it was damaging your brand?”
Brynne Tillman (16:30)
That leads me to this: you work with a lot of companies in training, and one question I get — and I have a few, but not a ton — is, what KPIs do you implement to measure whether a program is working?
Andrew Jenkins (16:49)
For companies, we use what I call the 3 Cs of Social ROI.
The first C is Community — did we grow your community over time? Was there more reach, engagement, and activity specific to that community?
The second C is Content — did we improve the performance of your content in terms of reach, impressions, and engagement? One of the biggest shifts we help clients make is moving from ad hoc, inconsistent posting to consistently sharing meaningful content.
The third C is Conversion — this could mean increased referral traffic to your website, downloads of a white paper, webinar registrations, newsletter sign-ups, or even transactions if it’s an e-commerce company.
For individuals, LinkedIn provides a lot of useful analytics. Start paying attention to profile views — are they coming from your target audience? Track impressions. There are third-party tools like Shield or Aware that provide even deeper insights, but even LinkedIn’s native analytics are valuable.
The SSI score seems to have faded, but regularly review your 365-day rolling data. Check your top posts from the past year — what worked best? Was it a pitch, something personal, or something about someone else? Pay attention to your activity and its impact on profile views, search appearances, and impressions.
Brynne Tillman (18:56)
That’s great! I’ll add one more — we do a search for ICP (Ideal Customer Profile) first-degree connections and track how many people are in that list. Then, during one-on-ones, we revisit it to see how many new ICP-aligned connections have been made. That’s been really helpful. From there, we can look at whether those people are converting to downloads or other engagement. I love that!
So, as we start to come in for a landing, is there any question I should have asked you that I didn’t?
Andrew Jenkins (19:41)
Hard to say… Maybe, “What’s your favorite social network?”
Brynne Tillman (19:56)
Okay, I think I know — but what is it?
Andrew Jenkins (20:00)
It’s evolved over the years. Twitter was my favorite for the longest time, and a part of my heart still hopes it turns around. We’re recording this during a time of global turmoil, and every time something major happens, Twitter—well, I still call it Twitter—reminds us of its role in spreading news rapidly.
Brynne Tillman (20:24)
I refuse to call it “X.”
Andrew Jenkins (20:27)
Same here. But since it was acquired by Elon Musk, it’s lost its luster. My new favorite, for the last four or five years, is TikTok. The algorithm amazes me — you don’t even have to follow anyone. The For You page just keeps getting better at delivering content you find engaging.
What’s fascinating is that my daughter and I have similar senses of humor, and despite being 35 years apart, our For You pages are almost identical because of how we interact with the algorithm. Many other platforms have tried to copy TikTok’s algorithmic feed because it delivers that dopamine hit with every post.
Brynne Tillman (21:43)
I said earlier I need to dip my toe in. We share on TikTok, but I don’t really use it.
Andrew Jenkins (21:51)
There’s a lot of valuable, even educational content there — things you didn’t know you could learn. I often find myself thinking, “I was today years old when I learned this.”
There’s even a TikTok account from Oxford Mathematics at the University of Oxford. A physicist posted two fascinating videos — one showing how to pour water out of a bottle faster, and another on how to stir coffee or tea without spilling, using physics.
Brynne Tillman (22:37)
Okay…
Andrew Jenkins (22:38)
For those listening or watching: when stirring coffee or tea, don’t stir in a circle. Move the spoon back and forth across the cup — it doesn’t spill. I didn’t know that until I saw it on TikTok! See? We’re all about delivering value here.
Brynne Tillman (23:02)
Awesome. I’m going to ask the classic question — where can people find you? (Though I’ll tell everyone first: go find Andrew on TikTok!)
Andrew Jenkins (23:09)
I’m active there, but most of my posts are clips from my podcast featuring my guests. You’ll find me primarily on LinkedIn — it’s linkedin.com/in/andrewjjenkins (that’s with a “J” in the middle). You’ll know it’s me because I have a Canadian flag in front of my name to distinguish me from other Andrew Jenkins.
My website is VolterraDigital.com.
Brynne Tillman (23:39)
Thank you so much for your insights. This was really fun, and I’m excited for people to learn from you. Thanks for being our guest!
And to all our listeners — when you’re out and about, don’t forget to Make Your Sales Social!
Outro (24:01)
Thanks for watching, and join us again for more special guest instructors, bringing you marketing, sales training, and social selling strategies that will set you apart. Hit the subscribe button below to get the latest episodes from the Making Sales Social podcast, give this video a thumbs up, and comment down below on what you want to hear from us next. You can also listen to us on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, Youtube Music, and Amazon Music. Visit our website, socialsaleslink.com for more information.