Episode 445: Becoming the Go-To Expert: David Newman on Building Market Eminence

David Newman (00:00)
It is risky, dangerous, and dumb to hire anyone else. And if you don’t do those three things—visibility to get seen, credibility through understanding your buyers better than they know themselves to win that level of respect, and brand preference where it is risky, dangerous, and dumb to hire or engage with anybody other than you or your company—you’ve nailed it.

Intro (00:25)
Welcome to the Making Sales Social podcast, featuring the top voices in sales, marketing, and business. Join Brynne Tillman and me, Bob Woods, as we bring you the best tips and strategies our guests are teaching their clients so you can leverage them for your own virtual and social selling. Enjoy the show.

Brynne Tillman (00:51)
Welcome back to Making Sales Social! Today’s guest is not only a remarkable thought leader but also a friend and my very first mentor when I transitioned from corporate to entrepreneur. David Newman has had a significant impact on my career and the way I approach business, and I’m grateful to have him here today.

David is a Certified Speaking Professional, a sought-after keynote speaker, and the host of The Selling Show, a top 1% global podcast. He has dedicated his career to helping founders, CEOs, and entrepreneurs build bold professional brands, grow their businesses, and achieve success on their own terms.

One of the many things that makes David’s work especially powerful is his focus on market eminence. You may have heard terms like thought leadership, personal branding, or market positioning—but market eminence goes further. It’s about becoming the go-to authority in your industry, the one who sets the conversation, influences decisions, and shapes how others think about the space.

David, welcome to the show!

David Newman (02:05)
Brynne, it’s so great to be here! But because of that incredibly amazing introduction, we’re out of time. Thank you, everyone—this was great!

Brynne Tillman (02:16)
Okay, well, we’re going to extend the time today because it’s really worth it. Awesome! So before we jump into your genius—and there’s so much to dive into—the one question we ask all of our guests is: what does “making sales social” mean to you?

David Newman (02:38)
Well, I have a biased answer because we’re going to talk about market eminence, but my definition of making selling social has the same three building blocks.

Number one: it’s very important to get seen. People don’t buy products, services, or expertise sight unseen. So, job number one in social selling is visibility.

Number two: there’s a level of respect. There’s so much noise everywhere, including on LinkedIn, that to win someone’s respect you need to have X-ray vision into their soul, their business, their company, and their problems. The moment they see your LinkedIn post, your homepage, or your latest article, they should think, “Oh my gosh, it feels like you were talking to me.”

The third element, especially today in the age of AI where everyone’s posting AI-generated content, is brand preference. When you do social selling the right way—and you, my friend, are one of the very few who teach this correctly—you convey through your value, your resources, and everything you put out that you are not only the smartest and safest choice, but that it’s risky, dangerous, and dumb to hire anyone else.

If you do those three things—visibility, credibility through deep understanding of your buyers, and brand preference—you’ve nailed social selling.

Brynne Tillman (04:43)
Rarely is there a mic drop moment that early, but that was brilliant. Alright, let’s dive into this concept of market eminence, which, by the way, I am obsessed with.

I’ll tell you—I asked AI about market eminence while preparing for today, and the first thing it said was, “This is David Newman’s framework that is revolutionizing marketing and how content goes to market.” I thought, “Oh, yay! That’s so cool!” So, I did a little deep dive, but I’d love to hear how you describe market eminence to someone hearing about it for the first time.

David Newman (05:39)
Sure. The easy answer—because I sort of cheated—is that it’s built on the same three building blocks I just mentioned: visibility, respect, and brand preference. But let’s go deeper.

We have to stop positioning ourselves as better. “We’re a better financial services firm,” “a better consultant,” “a better law firm,” “we make better widgets.” Better according to who? And by what metrics? Everyone claims to be better; a few claim to be the best—and that’s the worst thing you can do.

People don’t recognize “better.” What they recognize immediately is different.

So how can we go against the grain? How can we be different, rock the boat, make noise, be contrarian, bust some myths? One of my slides when I do keynotes has a big angry face and the headline “Who Are You Disturbing?”

That’s the point—you should be disturbing someone. Market eminence is like turning on a huge electromagnet that powerfully attracts your best-fit clients, prospects, team, media, partners, and investors, while equally repelling the bad fits.

That scares a lot of executives and entrepreneurs. They’ll say, “I don’t want to piss anyone off. We want to be okay for everyone.”

But my mantra is: If you don’t risk turning some people off, you will never turn anyone on.

And when you do this strategically, the only people you repel are the ones you’d never want as clients, employees, or partners because their worldview doesn’t align with yours. The world doesn’t need more vanilla—it needs more licorice.

The great business philosopher Jerry Garcia of the Grateful Dead said, “We’re like licorice. Not everyone likes licorice—it tastes weird, and people throw out the black jelly beans. But the people who love licorice love it a lot.”

That’s what I want for you—be more like licorice and less like vanilla. That, in a nutshell, is the message of market eminence.

Brynne Tillman (09:02)
I am definitely a licorice chick.

David Newman (09:05)
Me too—well, not a chick, but definitely a licorice dude.

Brynne Tillman (09:09)
I don’t judge! Awesome. I love that. So let’s talk about market eminence and being licorice. How do we find our licorice?

David Newman (09:25)
For most executives and entrepreneurs, it’s already there—it’s just unspoken. It’s the truths you talk about behind closed doors, the things that are missing, broken, or frustrating in your industry.

It’s what your clients complain about but no one addresses. It’s the elephant in the room.

Try this exercise:

• First, make a list of five practices in your industry that don’t serve clients—things you’ve already moved away from.

• Second, list five common complaints from clients—especially the serious ones that might have cost you a big account. Those painful lessons often spark real change.

Once that big client left because of an issue, what did you fix internally? And did you ever talk about it publicly? Probably not.

Take CVS as an example. Remember when CVS decided to stop selling cigarettes? All the other pharmacies still sold them. CVS realized, “We’re a health company—how can we sell cigarettes?” They walked away from billions in revenue to stand for something.

That’s what market eminence looks like—knowing what you stand for and what you stand against.

Brynne Tillman (12:22)
I love that it’s based on belief and choice—not just money. I’d even argue that CVS is probably the most successful of all the pharmacies and has more than made up for the cigarette money in other ways. Even if that wasn’t their only goal, what happens is that you start to attract the right clients. Not only are you doing what feels right and lets you sleep well at night, but you’re also attracting the people you actually want to work with.

David Newman (13:15)
Yes, absolutely. And I want to draw a bigger circle around that—“the people you want to work with.”

A lot of times, especially with social selling, we talk about customer acquisition. But think about your entire audience—the people around your company or your team. When you’re hiring, people want to work for a company and a leader with market eminence. When you’re seeking funding, investors want to back companies that are positioned as market leaders—those one or two notches above the crowd.

When you’re looking for partnerships—channel partners, media partners, project partners—or even preparing for acquisition, the same principle applies. Many entrepreneurs are on a “grow, scale, exit” path. If you want to sell your company at a premium, you need to become the bold, contrarian face and voice of your brand—someone who stands for something, stands against something, and leads clearly in your space.

Not for everyone—still not vanilla. We’re going 100% licorice because the world already has enough vanilla ice cream. Bold leadership made visible through market eminence.

Brynne Tillman (14:37)
Brilliant—really brilliant. So let’s say we’ve got an entrepreneur listening. She’s running a $7 million-a-year business and is thinking about building it to sell. She already has consistent client work, but why would shifting to market eminence be not just a “nice-to-have,” but a “must-have” on her journey to that ultimate goal?

David Newman (15:15)
First, if you’re that entrepreneur with a $7 million company, hire Brynne Tillman—that’s step one. Step two: listen to this.

If you’re serious about having a valuable, saleable asset—a company that can thrive under new ownership and management—you can’t just be an “also-ran.” You can’t just be another trucking company, law firm, or cheese manufacturer. There has to be something special.

And by special, I mean different—something that makes you stand out and injects a magnetic DNA into everything you say and do.

Here’s an exercise: think about things you could say or do that your competitors either (a) don’t do, (b) can’t do because they lack your insight, experience, or expertise, or (c) are afraid to do.

For example, imagine a law firm. Most law firms are still anchored in hourly billing. What if one said, “We reject hourly billing”?

They could say:

“We used to charge $800 an hour with 15 attorneys making millions in profit—but we stopped hourly billing because we’ve productized, systematized, and streamlined our legal services to serve the client first.”

And then their tagline could be:

“We’re more concerned with getting you to your destination than with running the meter.”

Imagine the content that could come from that—videos, LinkedIn posts, media interviews, conference talks: “Why our law firm stopped hourly billing and how we serve clients better instead.”

That would instantly resonate because everyone hates hourly billing—$200 for a phone call, $8 for a photocopy—it’s crazy.

So think about what you can do to separate yourself. What do your competitors not do, can’t do, or are afraid to do? You’ll come up with amazing ideas. Then you just need a little dose of bravery and boldness to test them, share them, and see the reaction. That’s how you begin your journey to market eminence.

Brynne Tillman (19:11)
That’s absolutely brilliant. When you work with clients, I know you help pull all of this out. But if I’m an entrepreneur who’s stuck—if I don’t know what my competitors won’t do—how do you get your clients to that aha moment where they find their go-to-market strategy?

David Newman (19:44)
Interestingly, about 80% of the time, the seeds are already there. They’re already doing some version of it—they’re just whispering it, treading carefully, not amplifying it.

Here’s a simple example: a home heating oil company. You’d think that’s a totally commoditized business—a race to the bottom on price. But imagine if one said:

“We guarantee that if your tank ever falls below 5% because of our oversight, we’ll refill it for free.”

That becomes the Never Empty Winter Guarantee.

Clients would never have to worry about running out of oil again. The company might already be calling when tanks get low, but they haven’t systematized, named, or productized it.

So the answer is twofold. First, we go through a deep dive—asking investigative, journalistic questions: What are you doing? Why are you doing it? How does it work? What do customers think? Sometimes we even talk directly to customers to learn why they stay and what makes the company special.

Then, after gathering that insight, we list out the practices, philosophies, and actions that define the business. We ask:

• Which of these can you truly own?

• Which matters most to your clients?

• Which would blow people away if they’d never heard of you before?

Take the law firm example again. Imagine hearing, “They don’t do hourly billing. Their fees are transparent, no sticker shock, no surprises.”

Ideally, your differentiator should be repeatable. For instance, if I told you about that law firm, I’d say:

“They’re more interested in getting you to your destination than in running the meter.”

That one line arms your entire ecosystem—clients, partners, fans—to repeat and amplify your message, building your reputation around that differentiator.

Brynne Tillman (22:39)
Oh my gosh—magic words!

One of the biggest lessons I learned from you, David, was the concept of productizing your offer. It’s one of the best lessons I’ve ever received—maybe 15 or so years ago—and I still use it today.

Back then, I realized I wasn’t just selling LinkedIn training; I was selling buyer mapping, KPI development, and content strategy. I turned it into a clear eight-stage framework for rolling out a social selling program—and it all came from your class.

To anyone listening: if you have an offer that isn’t productized, hire David. Truly. It made all the difference in the world. When people ask, “What am I buying?” you can now say, “You’re buying this product”—even if it started as a service. That clarity changes everything.

David Newman (24:07)
And what you just mentioned is another element of market eminence—making it visual.

Think of it as the “back of the napkin” test. Let’s say you’re sitting with your ideal prospect in an airport lounge. They put down their newspaper, look over, and say, “Hi, nice to meet you. I’m curious—what do you do?”

Could you pull out a napkin and, in 45 to 60 seconds, sketch three circles, a triangle, or a simple four-quadrant diagram to explain it? You might say, “Well, we help X with Y, and here’s the framework, the model, or the method we use.”

Taking your proprietary, productized service and giving it a simple visual allows people to understand it—and even see themselves inside that diagram—where they are now, and what they’re missing.

That’s what seals the deal in most sales conversations. Whether you’re in person drawing on a whiteboard, showing a slide in PowerPoint, sharing your screen on Zoom, or sketching on an iPad, the visual makes your service tangible and real. It gives you credibility and certainty in your prospect’s mind.

They’ll point at it and say, “I want that. I want that machine. I want that social selling system. I want that market eminence framework. I want that productized legal service that firm offers.”

Brynne Tillman (25:55)
Yeah, I love that. I might not be repeating this exactly—it was many years ago—but one of the conversation points I learned from you, or at least adapted from you, was this:

“Whether or not you decide to work with me, make sure that whoever you do work with includes all eight of these steps. Because if they don’t, something’s going to fall off.”

How did I do?

David Newman (26:24)
You did great! The only thing you missed is the label for that—it’s called setting the buying criteria.

You’re essentially saying, “Whether it’s with us or anyone else, these are the eight things you absolutely need.”

Now, even if they shop around—which they probably won’t—you’ve become the benchmark, the gold standard. Because you gave them the eight building blocks they must have.

Brynne Tillman (26:50)
Yeah, I hate to talk about myself, but I think I’m one of your best students.

David Newman (26:56)
I think you are. I agree with that statement.

Brynne Tillman (26:58)
I really internalized so much of what I learned from you, and I’m so grateful. I can’t say that enough.

All right, I’m totally off our planned questions, but this has been so much fun. Since we’re getting close to the end, let’s bring this home. What are some indicators that a business owner or leader is—or isn’t—achieving market eminence? How do you measure that?

David Newman (27:39)
Sure. Let’s start with the not hitting it list—it’s easier to recognize.

If you’re constantly facing price pressure, that’s a sign. Your buyers are commoditizing you because they can’t see how you’re cooler, better, or different than the competition.

The danger is that you’re competing with people who look like they do what you do—even though you’re more experienced, deliver more value, and have more integrity. But if the buyer can’t tell, they can’t tell.

Another indicator: how do people show up to your first conversation? Have they already consumed your content? Do they quote your phrases back to you? Do they say things like, “Oh my gosh, I read your website and felt like you wrote it for me—you knew exactly what we were going through!”

If you’re not getting that kind of reaction, that’s a clue you’re not hitting it right.

Here’s another one—and it might sound strange—but if you’re not getting a little bit of hate mail, you’re probably playing it too safe.

I had a client from New Orleans who once told me something his grandpappy used to say:

“Son, you ain’t nobody till somebody hates your guts.”

He was right! A little bit of pushback means you’re standing for something. So when someone says, “I can’t believe you’d do away with hourly billing!” or “How dare you promote that idea!”—that’s good. It means you’re bold enough to provoke thought.

So, to recap:

• If you’re easily interchangeable with competitors…

• If you’re under constant price pressure…

• If you never get hate mail…

• If people can’t tell what makes you better or different…

• If the phone isn’t ringing and no one’s banging down your door…

• If you’re not getting invited to stages, deals, or partnerships…

Then you’re still living in the land of vanilla—and it’s time to ramp up your licorice.

Brynne Tillman (31:02)
Oh my goodness, I love this! I could go on forever, but we do need to wrap up. So my last question—what question should I have asked you that I didn’t?

David Newman (31:18)
“David, are you thinking about writing a book on this topic?”

Brynne Tillman (31:23)
So David, you’ve already written some of the best books out there. Are you thinking about another one on this topic?

David Newman (31:30)
You know, Brynne, I am! By the time this episode airs, it may already be available—maybe even in beta launch.

The book is called Market Eminence. It covers 22 different strategies—we only talked about three or four today—to help you build a bold CEO brand and become a business celebrity in your niche.

It’s about driving unstoppable growth, where people seek you out not just for what you do, but for who you are and what you stand for.

Brynne Tillman (32:17)
And we really need that today—not just to grow our businesses, but to be better at what we do and bring more value that aligns with who we are as humans. I love this so much.

Other than everyone listening going out to buy the book, how else can people work with you or get in touch?

David Newman (32:39)
All of my resources and links are at DoItMarketing.com. That’s my company website.

You’ll find lots of free resources there—and when I say free, I mean totally ungated, no email required. Just go to DoItMarketing.com/hello.

Brynne Tillman (33:06)
I love it, my friend. Thank you for bringing your genius.

David Newman (33:11)
Thank you for having me! And by the way, you mentioned my podcast earlier—you forgot to say The Selling Show Podcast featuring Brynne Tillman—multiple episodes featuring my amazing friend Brynne Tillman.

Brynne Tillman (33:30)
Love it! Thank you again—and to all of our listeners, when you’re out and about, don’t forget to make your sales social.

Outro (33:39)

Thanks for watching, and join us again for more special guest instructors, bringing you marketing, sales training, and social selling strategies that will set you apart. Hit the subscribe button below to get the latest episodes from the Making Sales Social podcast, give this video a thumbs up, and comment down below on what you want to hear from us next. You can also listen to us on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, Youtube Music, and Amazon Music. Visit our website, socialsaleslink.com for more information.